I use to think discussing religion with people that didn't acknowledge the existance of Allah, were hard to talk too. They seemed unreasonable and bluntly ignorant. I was wrong I generalized all of them. Yes, some people are like that. And those people can be extremely difficult to engage in conversation but its because they don't have an ounce of sincerity in them and find satisfaction from argumentation. And than again there are some Atheist who actually use logic and reason. They actually contemplate the world rather than accepting a religion that was handed down to them. In blind belief and not questioning what our real purpose of life is. Islam encourages us to use our logic and reason.
"Zakir, why are you congratulating an atheist?" The reason that I am congratulating an atheist is because he agrees with the first part of the Shahada i.e. the Islamic Creed, ‘La ilaaha’ - meaning ‘there is no God’. So half my job is already done; now the only part left is ‘il lallah’ i.e. ‘BUT ALLAH’ which I shall do Insha Allah. With others (who are not atheists) I have to first remove from their minds the wrong concept of God they may have and then put the correct concept of one true God."
MashAllah. Also before I go on how we should show them the signs of Allah Subhana Wa Talas existence, we really need to re-evaluate our manners. A lot of the times we see Muslims in a dialogue with non-Muslims and they're behavior is absolutely ridiculous. They put the person down and even result in profanity! A major key factor is to talk to them with dignity do not belittle anyone, It will destroy your message and defeat your purpose entirely. Just some advice when you converse with an Atheist you should use the Scientific Miracles of the Quran. Of course the Quran isn't a science book but a guide for humanity. Try to xplain to them how it has not been changed since revelation came down 1400years ago. Unlike many other doctrines that have been changed numerous of times. It contains scientific miracles, just to name a few The big Bang theory, Embryology, the Seas barrier between salt water and fresh etc, etc, etc,. Most of these facts were not even discovered until the 20century.
Everything that exists is an evidence of a Divine Creator, in the Heavens and Earth and even within ourselves. As Humans we aren't perfect but yet this world is, in the since of everything is in a order, in perfect harmony synchrosing as one. The alignment of the Sun and Moon that both follow a distinct course. The transition from day to night. The perfect amount of oxygen and carbon for us to survive. Take for an example your own body, all your organs, nerves and parts are working subject to the laws of nature, and have no choice but to work as they are intended to. How can I present an evidence of God when the signs can be seen everywhere?
"Soon We will show them our signs in the (farthest) regions (of the earth), and in their own souls, until it becomes manifest to them that this is the Truth. Is it not enough that thy Lord doth witness all things?"[Al-Quran 41:53]
Salaam sis :)
ReplyDeleteI have never actually conversed with an atheist about what their beliefs were except for a few friends who merely accept whatever their parents believed in (or rather the lack of it).. and all they can say that since we cannot see God, how then can we be sure of His existence?
Anyway sis, I saw this same topic on turntoislam.com This atheist explained why he does not belive in God, through logic and reasoning skills like you mentioned in the post. I was quite surprised to read about the way he view his existence in this world. His arguments were waaay more sophisticated than my atheist friends.
And oh, I laughed at the part when Dr Zakir Naik said that he has done half of his job when an atheist agrees to part of the syahadah "there is no god..." lol.
I am not too sure about how to talk to an Atheist. We cannot exactly find anything parallel to start of a topic with like how we would with Christians about Jesus etc.
Anyway, if you have not read the thread on tti, I think you should because you'll find it interesting. Some of our brothers there became quite emotional in their arguments and I think soon enough, they will drive him away. He is there for a discussion anyway so they shouldn't expect him to believe what we believe. To each his own.
The Quran has revealed to us so many miracles of this world, all consistent to what scientists have discovered today. The atheist said that we should not follow blind faith of my parents which is true, but I can tell you now that subhnAllah, reading through the Quran and contemplating the verses will just strengthen your beliefs (ok, at least for me) because of the undeniable proofs in it. It is not blind faith when we can actually feel it in your hearts that it is the truth.
Well, I guess that is what we Muslims feel. I bet he doesn't feel that way though. Anyway, May Allah guide him to the truth insyaAllah.
p.s. why do I get this feeling that you are a member on TTI? It's like I know you from somewhere lol.
Wa Alakyam Salam Sister :),
ReplyDeleteYour always the first one to comment on my Posts, MashAllah! Jazak Allah Khair! I really appreciate your feedback and positive comments =).InshAllah you are doing well and is in the highest of Imaan!
You know I never really got into a deep conversation with an Atheist in person but I have talked to them online. Just because we "congratulate some atheist" I still feel the need to add its the most irrational belief system! Granted a lot of these people have had bad experiences with other religions and haven't seen the beauty of Islam. So they refute all religions and deny there's a Higher Being. When someone uses the "We can't see Him how does God exist"? The similitude of that is stating "I can't see oxygen therefor it doesn't exist." SubhanAllah.
"A little knowledge of science makes man an atheist, but an in-depth study of science makes him a believer in God" -Francis Bacon
You realize how small you are and start to contemplate this Dunya. At times I feel they are very close minded and aren't aware of the blessings we have received from Allah. They live without purpose and you see in their face their in dire need of guidance. While these people are smart enough not to take Isa (AS) as Allah. (Authi Billah). They are still very much lost in this world.
I haven't heard about Turn to Islam Forums but InshAllah i'll definitely check it out. Alhamdulillah theres so many forums now it's hard to keep track of them all lol! Haha no I'm not a member I recently started to get active in promoting Islam online. The only thing I started to go was on Islam talk or Islam Speak on Stickam.
And I hope the brothers keep their composure inshAllah. Exactly sister to each is their own, MashAllah. People need to understand not everyone is going to agree with what we think. And we shouldn't take it to heart when they don't. I mean come on, the Prophets (peace be upon all of them) they were recieving revelation from Allah and yet people didn't accept the message.
The Quran is miraculous and when you really open your heart up to it than will you be able to see the Gems it contains. It's a mercy for us and at times we think its a burden to read it. And yeah just keep him in your duas and inshAllah I will to. Ameen sister!
Wa Salam, Take care! May Allah lighten your path to Jennah! Ameen.
salam:) masya allah! great post! i love reading about tis. the part where those who deny the existence of Allah by saying that they cant see god is actually something that is illogical as in how do they define god? with hands ,legs eyes and feet? is that what they want to see in god and then they will believe in god?? they think god is like us humans who has legs or in short, in physical form.
ReplyDeleteWa Alakyam Salam mawaddah =),
ReplyDeleteAlhamdulilah, I'm glad you enjoyed the post! Exactly humans defaecate and urinate, Allah does neither of that (authi bilah). Allah is the supreme being and doesn't feel any slumber. Who would want to take on a God that sleeps when he is praying to him lol?
Like in the Christian doctrines, God made the heavens and earth in 6 days and took a rest on the 7th? Just doesn't make since to me one bit.
Wa Salam!
Salaam sisters,
ReplyDeleteI have to add a point a brother raised as well. Atheists (I'm not sure if All) believe in Darwin's theory of evolution. He said that that is how we evolve from and will keep evolving (if I remember correctly that's what he said).
If an Atheist only believes what is being presented in front of him, like how he doesnt believe in a God unless he can see him, then he is actually having faith by believing in evolution that he cannot see. That is flawed logic I feel.
I think the signs of the existence of a God can be seen everywhere. How do you explain the nature around us, the four seasons, our heart beat (and when it stops beating), sunrises... too many to mention! It does not come "naturally" but there has to be a higher power being (God) to control all these.
Without a doubt, Allah has veiled their minds & hearts. You know, sometimes I read about something so obvious to me but people just cannot seem to grasp it (like how my friend said they pray to Jesus to reach God. then I asked, who is God? And they replied Jesus)..
Anyway, haha, just wanted to add these few things. Interesting topic ;)
Assalam Alaikom Mariumaa!
ReplyDeleteI haven't had a conversation with an atheist, but I have had a conversation with a Christian friend, who was trying to get me to become a christian (!) lol. But I did take the opportunity to ask her some questions, like I asked her about the Holy Trinity and she gave an absurd explanation. She also talked about how God created us in his image, so that means he is physical like us. (AstaghfirAllah!)
Sometimes I look at people who are good and kind, but don't believe in one God, Allah, and I wonder when will they see the right path? I have Hindu friends who believe in many small gods but if you ask them, they'll give weird explanations and yeah, most of them don't know what they believe and they just follow their parents.
May Allah guide us. And may Allah help us to guide them.
Asalamu Alakyam sisters =] =]
ReplyDeleteMashAllah I agree very contradicting sis Asha, Ha-ha that's too funny. I bet that question really got that person thinking If they had faith and Allah willed it.
Congratulations sis Asmi for picking your Blog name :)! I have been in the same position, they don't let you talk. And when you do get some words out they are on to the next thing about Christianity. But it gets you thinking MashAllah if that person was to become a Muslim they would be just as tactful in spreading dawah. Ameen Ya Rab!!
Although I can appreciate what Dr Zakir Naik is trying to say, I will have to disagree with it. Remember the verse where Allah says that shirk is the most unforgivable sin? Why is it that Christians are punished even though they at least believe in a God, but Atheists who do not commit the same shirk are also sent to hell?
ReplyDeleteThink about it.
The Kalimah is "There is no DEITY worthy of worship but Allah". Yes, Atheists do commit shirk too because they believe in deities by saying things like, "we are our own gods" and even "our creator is mother nature". Those are their deities.
This is my reason for disagreeing with Dr Zakir Naik's statement, even though it may seem funny at first.
I like the part where you quoted Surah 41, verse 53. MashaAllah.
Asalamu Alakyam brother Adib :)
ReplyDeleteDr.Zaik is well known for his dawah to non Muslims. And from what I got out of his lecture he wasn't saying Atheist weren't free from shirk. Rather for him it was easier to talk to them about accepting Islam. Due to the fact they weren't holding fundamental beliefs that went against Islam like Christians. They usually use Logic and Reason, key components in Islam. I completely agree with you about them committing shirk. Not only that they are an Infidel, completely rejecting the belief in Islam and are unappreciative of Allahs Blessings upon us.
Wa salam BarakAllah Feek!
Salam
ReplyDeleteWhat I had to say was tell them this, they want an explanation from science to prove their theory, right. Tell them about the Probability.
In mathematics there is a theory known as ‘Theory of Probability’. If you have two options, out of which one is right, and one is wrong, the chances that you will chose the right one is half, i.e. one out of the two will be correct. You have 50% chances of being correct. Similarly if you toss a coin the chances that your guess will be correct is 50% (1 out of 2) i.e. 1/2. If you toss a coin the second time, the chances that you will be correct in the second toss is again 50% i.e. half. But the chances that you will be correct in both the tosses is half multiplied by half (1/2 x 1/2) which is equal to 1/4 i.e. 50% of 50% which is equal to 25%. If you toss a coin the third time, chances that you will be correct all three times is (1/2 x 1/2 x 1/2) that is 1/8 or 50% of 50% of 50% that is 12½%.
A dice has got six sides. If you throw a dice and guess any number between 1 to 6, the chances that your guess will be correct is 1/6. If you throw the dice the second time, the chances that your guess will be correct in both the throws is (1/6 x 1/6) which is equal to 1/36. If you throw the dice the third time, the chances that all your three guesses are correct is (1/6 x 1/6 x 1/6) is equal to 1/216 that is less than 0.5 %.
Let us apply this theory of probability to the Qur’an, and assume that a person has guessed all the information that is mentioned in the Qur’an which was unknown at that time. Let us discuss the probability of all the guesses being simultaneously correct.
At the time when the Qur’an was revealed, people thought the world was flat, there are several other options for the shape of the earth. It could be triangular, it could be quadrangular, pentagonal, hexagonal, heptagonal, octagonal, spherical, etc. Lets assume there are about 30 different options for the shape of the earth. The Qur’an rightly says it is spherical, if it was a guess the chances of the guess being correct is 1/30.
The light of the moon can be its own light or a reflected light. The Qur’an rightly says it is a reflected light. If it is a guess, the chances that it will be correct is 1/2 and the probability that both the guesses i.e the earth is spherical and the light of the moon is reflected light is 1/30 x 1/2 = 1/60.
Further, the Qur’an also mentions every living thing is made of water. Every living thing can be made up of either wood, stone, copper, aluminum, steel, silver, gold, oxygen, nitrogen, hydrogen, oil, water, cement, concrete, etc. The options are say about 10,000. The Qur’an rightly says that everything is made up of water. If it is a guess, the chances that it will be correct is 1/10,000 and the probability of all the three guesses i.e. the earth is spherical, light of moon is reflected light and everything is created from water being correct is 1/30 x 1/2 x 1/10,000 = 1/60,000 which is equal to about .0017%.
The Qur’an speaks about hundreds of things that were not known to men at the time of its revelation. Only in three options the result is .0017%. I leave it upto you, to work out the probability if all the hundreds of the unknown facts were guesses, the chances of all of them being correct guesses simultaneously and there being not a single wrong guess. It is beyond human capacity to make all correct guesses without a single mistake, which itself is sufficient to prove to a logical person that the origin of the Qur’an is Divine.
Wa Alakyam Salam Rahmatullahi Wa Barakatuh =),
ReplyDeleteWow, MashAllah. That's a great approach to take, especially if the person knows anything about math, they wouldn't have anything to say back. I also like the way you said "I leave it up to you"! Leaving it up to the person to draw their own conclusions. Rather than preaching your informing.
I appreciate you taking the time to write that comment. MashAllah very insightful and useful, May Allah reward you greatly. Ameen
PS:I hope you don't mind if I post your comment so everyone could benefit? BarakAllah feek. Wa Salam.